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Joneser
01-07-2009, 02:48 PM
I've been thinking of competing in a Rib cook-off this summer (I think Travis will compete too) I have a sponsor as well as a butcher that will supply my meat. My question is, what do I look for in a rack of ribs? What makes them "Competition" ribs?
Thanks in advance,
Brian

Fatback Joe
01-07-2009, 03:01 PM
What makes them "Competition" ribs?


You do!

Besides that, I am not sure how I would describe it.......one of those I know a good rack when I see it. Not fatty, but not too lean, no shiners, straight bones, even meat thickness across the rack.

SmokyOkie
01-07-2009, 04:25 PM
size matters as well.

Smaller pig=smaller muscle=finer muscle fibers=less stringy meat. I look for 4 and downs ( 4# or less, and that's for whole slabs, not Stlooies) oh yeah, I'm talkin' spare ribs as opposed to the pork chops with the meat cut off that they call baby back ribs.

BBs are prolly a better choice if you not real experienced at spares. In that case, I think Joe covered it pretty well. Just look for meaty ones, the ones that look redder as opposed to pink usually have better flavor. look for good marbling in the meat, but avoid the ones that have thick veins of fat in them.

msmith
01-07-2009, 04:43 PM
I don't know what the rules are where you are located but here in Tx they wont let us use baby back ribs. We have to use St Louis style.

Joneser
01-07-2009, 05:05 PM
I don't know what the rules are where you are located but here in Tx they wont let us use baby back ribs. We have to use St Louis style.

I'm pretty sure it's spares we have to use. I have yet to see the rules. Now, If it is, in fact spares, do you usually leave them whole or cut them down to St. Louis style?

Thanks so much for all the pointers! I'm getting excited about this!:woohoo:

redneck cooker
01-07-2009, 05:18 PM
Joneser, I believe that if your cooking KCBS , you can cook loin back or spares...whatever your choice is.


Here in Texas all you can cook for comp is spares, you can trim them down to the "St Louis style" but must start out at spares...hope this helps..:msn-wink:

californiasmokin
01-07-2009, 06:21 PM
Joneser, I believe that if your cooking KCBS , you can cook loin back or spares...whatever your choice is.


Here in Texas all you can cook for comp is spares, you can trim them down to the "St Louis style" but must start out at spares...hope this helps..:msn-wink:

:sign0016:To the Joint Redneck Cooker!!!
Why don't you go to come on in and sit down and introduce yourself so everyone can greet you proper!

SmokyOkie
01-07-2009, 10:34 PM
I don't know what the rules are where you are located but here in Tx they wont let us use baby back ribs. We have to use St Louis style.


Joneser, I believe that if your cooking KCBS , you can cook loin back or spares...whatever your choice is.


Here in Texas all you can cook for comp is spares, you can trim them down to the "St Louis style" but must start out at spares...hope this helps..:msn-wink:

Kcbs allows BBS and they also allow glazing with sauce.

I don't think they should allow either one, And I also don't think they should allow St Looies. I also think all sauce should be on the side only.

Just my:twocents:

Fatback Joe
01-08-2009, 07:30 AM
Now, If it is, in fact spares, do you usually leave them whole or cut them down to St. Louis style?


All I have ever used in comps is St. Louis. I think it is easier to make a nice presentation with them vs whole spares.

Bbq Bubba
01-08-2009, 08:31 AM
What makes them "Competition" ribs?


This will get ya pretty close.....

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/2701/bbqribs1xd7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
By imn88fan (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/imn88fan)

Joneser
01-08-2009, 08:43 AM
This will get ya pretty close.....

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/2701/bbqribs1xd7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
By imn88fan (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/imn88fan)

Ahh....the "Hot Brine" method.....I'm sure that will score big!
What would I do without you, Bubba! :roflmaoha0:

redneck cooker
01-08-2009, 09:08 AM
I have never..ever seen anybody boil ribs to eat much less for a comp....

Joneser
01-08-2009, 09:12 AM
I have never..ever seen anybody boil ribs to eat much less for a comp....
LMAO! that's kind of an insider joke......Bubba is always busting someones balls with that boiled ribs pic. I'd NEVER EVER boil a rib...EVER!
:D

redneck cooker
01-08-2009, 09:14 AM
:wings:Whew!!!! that was a close one!!!!:msn-wink:

SmokyOkie
01-08-2009, 03:58 PM
I thought that was how they made 'em up north.

Bubba, you mean to tell me all this time I've been trying to copy your ribs and win comps..........:tap:

msmith
01-08-2009, 07:15 PM
Well if I have to resort to that method of cooking ribs, Thats it I'm done an gonna dismantle the General and throw in the Towel.

Chargrilled
01-08-2009, 08:42 PM
I've been thinking of competing in a Rib cook-off this summer (I think Travis will compete too) I have a sponsor as well as a butcher that will supply my meat. My question is, what do I look for in a rack of ribs? What makes them "Competition" ribs?
Thanks in advance,
Brian
Ive done a riboff with a case of b backs that we split and size does matter not to mention some of the loin meat was cut so close that the top of one rib was exposed during cookin. Thank god we cook like 6 racks and gave the judges choice:msn-wink:.

We will have to talk Joneser. I am PMin ya my info. We just may have to enter under The Q Joint 2 BBQ team my friend. Providing I get my banner here soon!!:msn-wink:

We took 2nd outta like 10 at a backyard event last year. Coolers were empty though and saw smiling faces for the bunch!

Smokin Bill
01-08-2009, 08:55 PM
Kcbs allows BBS and they also allow glazing with sauce.

I don't think they should allow either one, And I also don't think they should allow St Looies. I also think all sauce should be on the side only.

Just my:twocents:

You know I dont compete but I have to agree with you wholeheartedly. Ribs are smoked ribs not sauce; sauce can cover up a lot of shortcomings. I only do dry ribs myself and people love em, though there are people who like some sauce on them, most eat mine dry.

SmokyOkie
01-08-2009, 09:40 PM
Well if I have to resort to that method of cooking ribs, Thats it I'm done an gonna dismantle the General and throw in the Towel.

Easy Marvin, I was just kidding.


Ive done a riboff with a case of b backs that we split and size does matter not to mention some of the loin meat was cut so close that the top of one rib was exposed during cookin. Thank god we cook like 6 racks and gave the judges choice:msn-wink:.!

That would be what they call a shiner.


You know I dont compete but I have to agree with you wholeheartedly. Ribs are smoked ribs not sauce; sauce can cover up a lot of shortcomings. I only do dry ribs myself and people love em, though there are people who like some sauce on them, most eat mine dry.

That's Oklahoma style, naked ribs with sauce on the side. Around here there are two totally separate arts; meat, and sauce

redneck cooker
01-09-2009, 09:11 AM
We also use a heavy sweet glaze here in Texas , personally I like to eat ribs with just a good dry rub...but when it comes to winning ...they better be glazed sweet...:msn-wink:


I totally agree with you Smokin Bill, I think we should cook ribs for comp with no glaze at all, allit does is cover iup the great smoke flavor that I work so harsd to obtain...

msmith
01-09-2009, 03:31 PM
Getting back to the original question from joinser, yes I do cut the St Louis style ribs myself. I had always cooked the BB or the Loin Back BB for family get togethers. Then I seen a video on how to cut St Louis style ribs from spare ribs. I believe it was Fat Back Joe that posted it in another forum don't quote me for sure have sleep since then. I do like to give credit where credit is do.

Around here they want them cut St Louis style. But thats ok you can take the left overs which they call rib tips and have a good meal just off of them.

Redneck cooker hit the nail on the head for some strange reason the sweeter the ribs are the better they seem to like them. ( The judges that is)


I'm like SmokeyOakie to hell with all that sauce and bull s**t I wanna taste the meat with a good smoke flavor. Why would you want to take a perfectly good rack of ribs and drown them with ketchup and ruin the taste.

Doin't worry Oakie I would never take the General apart and throw in the towel.

SmokyOkie
01-09-2009, 03:48 PM
I think the deal is that most of the judges you are cooking for are not true Q folks, but rather what I call "Famous Dave's Fans), you know, the type that wants the meat to be about like mush, and boiled would be OK so long as it had a nice sweet glaze.

I think that's why you almost always have one or two judges that pan your stuff even when the others are giving out 9s.

BTW, Unless something's changes, Baby back ribs abd Loin back ribs are one in the same, just a pork chop woth most of the meat cut off.:msn-wink:

Smokin Bill
01-09-2009, 03:54 PM
I think the deal is that most of the judges you are cooking for are not true Q folks, but rather what I call "Famous Dave's Fans), you know, the type that wants the meat to be about like mush, and boiled would be OK so long as it had a nice sweet glaze.

Now you've got a bad attitude; you best hope no judges read that, they'll be sendin Gweto your way.:roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0:

msmith
01-09-2009, 05:09 PM
Now you've got a bad attitude; you best hope no judges read that, they'll be sendin Gweto your way.:roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0:


Gotta watch that Smokie Oakie he just loves a good fight.

Smokin Bill
01-09-2009, 05:16 PM
Gotta watch that Smokie Oakie he just loves a good fight.

I know but look at the good side, he has me switched from liquid smoke to creosote for flavoring my foods.:roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0::roflmao ha0:

Capt Dan
01-09-2009, 09:07 PM
That right there is funny!:roflmaoha0:

Chargrilled
01-09-2009, 09:15 PM
I know but look at the good side, he has me switched from liquid smoke to creosote for flavoring my foods.:roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0::roflmao ha0:

Oh Jesus, here we go:smack::oops:

BA_LoKo
01-09-2009, 09:20 PM
Bill, he convinced me to boil my ribs and brisket for the best results in tenderness. He really does know what he's talkin' about, huh? And, he's always here to help.

Smokin Bill
01-09-2009, 09:24 PM
Oh Jesus, here we go:smack::oops:
OH NO!!! I'm fully purswaded; creosote IS the way to go.:msn-wink:

Here's how I look at it; it's cheaper (who can complain about that these days), has far more viscosity so it sticks to the meat (you wont find this stuff running down the grease drain), and the fuller body of flavor cant be matched by that thin washed out liquid smoke stuff and your butts injected with creosote can last the better part of 100 years without refrigeration. Creosote is definitely the way to go.

It's a MANS SEASONING.:bandit:

Chargrilled
01-09-2009, 09:26 PM
Gotta watch that Smokie Oakie he just loves a good fight.

He's got Tim down to a science, OAKIE. Show em the tree AGAIN OKIE!!!


:roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0: God I can not wait to talk again with ya bro on skype!!!

BA_LoKo
01-09-2009, 09:45 PM
OH NO!!! I'm fully purswaded; creosote IS the way to go.:msn-wink:

Here's how I look at it; it's cheaper (who can complain about that these days), has far more viscosity so it sticks to the meat (you wont find this stuff running down the grease drain), and the fuller body of flavor cant be matched by that thin washed out liquid smoke stuff and your butts injected with creosote can last the better part of 100 years without refrigeration. Creosote is definitely the way to go.

It's a MANS SEASONING.:bandit:

You betcha. Pine logs and railroad ties for me. Wanna come over for dinner? :smack: :roflmaoha0:

SmokyOkie
01-09-2009, 10:32 PM
Now you've got a bad attitude; you best hope no judges read that, they'll be sendin Gweto your way.:roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0:

I am a judge, and most of the judges I know know who's a Famous Dave's fan and who's a q guy.

Read some old threads, and you'll hear where a KCBS certified judge made the statement " I don't really like that smoky taste on my food." and " There's no such thing as a good spare rib, I've never had one, and I'm sure I never will"

The issue is that there just aren't enough real Q folks to supply the demand for god judges. Any good sized comp leaves the KCBS reps out seraching the crowd for enough judges to fill the tables, well at least any one that I've been to.

Smokin Bill
01-09-2009, 10:33 PM
You betcha. Pine logs and railroad ties for me. Wanna come over for dinner? :smack: :roflmaoha0:
I gatta tell ya LoKo, Iza gatta be loyal to my friend and mentor SmokyOkie so ifin he's invited, I'll be over.:cowboy:

Bbq Bubba
01-10-2009, 02:26 PM
I have never..ever seen anybody boil ribs to eat much less for a comp....

You've never been to a BBQ restaurant???


We also use a heavy sweet glaze here in Texas , personally I like to eat ribs with just a good dry rub...but when it comes to winning ...they better be glazed sweet...:msn-wink:


I totally agree with you Smokin Bill, I think we should cook ribs for comp with no glaze at all, allit does is cover iup the great smoke flavor that I work so harsd to obtain...

The best advise i can give you guys is that if your going to cook with that frame of mind, just plan on going to have a good time! :msn-wink:

SmokyOkie
01-10-2009, 04:27 PM
Believe it or not some compers have actually won blues with naked ribs. Habitual smokers for one.

crewdawg52
01-26-2009, 12:50 PM
If talking about comps and judging, here's one for ya'll......

When I took the KCBS Judging class (Silver Lake, MI '07 taught by Mike and Teressa Lake), there was a gal there who actual asked Mike this question ... and I quote....

"I dont like to eat any pork at all, so when I'm judging, do I have to taste the ribs and pulled pork"?

Our response ( the class) to her was ........ :smack:

redneck cooker
01-26-2009, 12:53 PM
:roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0:OMG!!!!! thats too funny!!

Capt Dan
01-26-2009, 01:45 PM
She just wanted to be a designated chicken and brisket judge huh?:roflmaoha0:

Smokin Bill
01-26-2009, 01:51 PM
Let me guess; she was blond?:roflmaoha0:

crewdawg52
01-27-2009, 12:49 PM
Let me guess; she was blond?:roflmaoha0:

In truth......... she was:smack: . Bud And Tonto117 were in the class also so they can verify the authenticity of said Dumba**

cowgirl
01-27-2009, 12:58 PM
Hey...not all blondes are idiots. :smack::D

She does sound like a real winner though....:wo:

Smokin Bill
01-27-2009, 02:12 PM
In truth......... she was:smack: . Bud And Tonto117 were in the class also so they can verify the authenticity of said Dumba**

Thought so; you see there really are people who need the first line of the cooking instructions on a frozen pizza box to say "Remove from box and take off plastic wrapper".:roflmaoha0:

Jake
01-27-2009, 03:27 PM
great post,:thumbs up: :roflmaoha0: and funny to boot :msn-wink: gotta admit i was scared when i read boiled ribs, too funny someone at work asked me the other day if i boil the ribs first. :shrug: true story

SmokyOkie
01-27-2009, 04:57 PM
The first comp I judged there was a CBJ sitting next to me that, after judging ribs, stated"There's no such thing as a good spare rib". Her husband, also a CBJ was judging at another table. He came over during a break to visit. He made this statement "Some of these idiots didn;t even know enough to remove the membrane from the ribs. That's an automatic 5 from me"

Of course, I informed him that it is perfectly acceptable to leave the on and that if the ribs were properly cooked, he would not even notice that the membrane was there. This guy was a food network idjit. He had never cooked a slab of ribs in his life, yet he knew enough to ruin somebody's score?

the Okette judged at another table. She told me that the CBJ sitting next to her informed her about halfway through the comp that "She didn;t really like that smoky taste on her BBQ".

This is why it's so tough to figure out what to cook.

Butt Lover's
01-27-2009, 05:17 PM
MOST of the people taking the KCBS CJ class with me and my friend did not have a clue. The guys setting next to me were discussing the different flavors of the entries...THEY WERE ALL THE SAME!

They were all the same recipe off the same smoker. I know they are going to be a little different but you should have heard them. LMAO

Also, even after it was explained that you could TQ a fake smoke ring, we had people judging down ribs and brisket because it had no smoke ring!

Those people give a bad rep to the majority of CJ 's who know what they are doing.

Jake
01-27-2009, 05:21 PM
thats some scary chit

Fatback Joe
01-27-2009, 05:35 PM
"She didn;t really like that smoky taste on her BBQ".


When I accidently forgot to add wood to my WSM when doing chicken I got 9th place..........never was out of the 20s before that...........the second time I left the wood out on purpose and got 1st. Go figure. :shrug:

Smokin Bill
01-27-2009, 05:55 PM
There must not be any judges here because I've questioned judges on other threads and it is an instant nuclear war.:ack2:

Jake
01-27-2009, 05:57 PM
There must not be any judges here because I've questioned judges on other threads and it is an instant nuclear war.:ack2:

no theres judges just not crap ones :msn-wink: :roflmaoha0:

SmokyOkie
01-27-2009, 06:43 PM
There are judges on this site. They just happen to know that there are crappy judges ou there.

Stop and think about it and do the math. There really aren;t enough BBQ artists out there to judge a comp, and most of the ones that are there are cooking.

Jake
01-27-2009, 08:35 PM
maybe they should taste each others than:blushing:

Fatback Joe
01-28-2009, 07:30 AM
As with everything in life, you can't be everything to everyone. The majority of the judges in IMO do a real good job, there are a few that don't and the best you can do is try not to hit their table.

It sucks and I know I have *****ed about "that one damn judge" in the past and probably will going forward, but every team out there has to deal with the same thing.

As someone told me in Okeechobee last week.......if you have won your table, then you did all you can do.

crewdawg52
01-28-2009, 07:44 AM
no theres judges just not crap ones :msn-wink: :roflmaoha0:

I second that!!!!!!:msn-wink:

crewdawg52
01-28-2009, 07:58 AM
The sad thing is.... Teams put up several hundreds of dollars to compete. And by doing this, hope to be judged fairly. I've seen too many times (like EVERY comp I've been in or judged) a shortage of judges. So, they start grabbing people who happen to walking past the judges tent and give them a quick 1-2 minute "Here's how you judge a bbq competition". I've seen our scores range from 5 - 9 from the individual judges from the same table.

Like others have stated, most of the certified judges try and do a good job. It's just very fustrating when you dont place or "walk" because you lost out by .025 points, and when you check the scores, you have 7's, 8's, and a 9, but there's that 5:tap: because someone doesn't like pork, or a smoky flavor.....

SmokyOkie
01-28-2009, 11:36 AM
Yeah, our last comp the pork had all 9s form four judges except one eight.

Then the other two judges gave it sixes and sevens.

The thing we all need to remember too is that taste is a subjective thing and not all judges have the same tastes.

That's what makes the comps difficult is playing to a crowd that you don't know.

Jake
01-30-2009, 10:56 PM
jerks..... dont be a judge if you know jack, however they would be your average joe and may be new to q and its up to us to win them :blushing: just would be nice if the judges were on a level playing field.... screws with all of us

SmokyOkie
01-30-2009, 11:06 PM
Just remember Jake, there aren;t enough good judges available. there just aren't that many folks out there that know as much about the subject as we do, and to boot, we have a great many disagreements due to taste even between us. that's what makes the competition ting so interesting. why don't you get certified as a judge?

Jake
01-31-2009, 02:23 PM
gotta watch my waist line :msn-wink: i'll look into it, i wonder if i can do that somewere down here, guess i'll have to google it.:shrug:

crewdawg52
02-03-2009, 01:41 AM
I truely believe, to be a good judge, you have to know how to cook good bbq, and judge several comps! Anyone can take a class and be a judge. If you cook Q, you will make mistakes! If someone says they never...... :smack: (thats why I have a "sammie" container for dry stuff I ground up and added stuff for a spread") By learning from your mistakes, you will become a better cook, thus becoming a better judge! :twocents:

Jake
02-03-2009, 12:28 PM
:woohoo:im a learning alright :msn-wink: if and when i mess it, just close my eyes and shovel.....or slip it to the dog :roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0: i dont think it matters who you are, every now and then everyone screws up something especially with food.

SmokyOkie
02-03-2009, 02:12 PM
I truely believe, to be a good judge, you have to know how to cook good bbq, and judge several comps!

Therein lies the problem Geoff, most of the good BBQ chefs are cooking and there aren't enough left to judge the comp.


:woohoo:im a learning alright :msn-wink: if and when i mess it, just close my eyes and shovel.....or slip it to the dog :roflmaoha0::roflmaoha0: i dont think it matters who you are, every now and then everyone screws up something especially with food.

And good chef also experiments, and often, the experiments don't turn out the way you think they should.

jminion
02-23-2009, 08:07 PM
Interesting thread. I am a KCBS Rep, judge and judge trainer, I enjoy cookin much more than any of the rest.

Some of the worst judges are the Master Judges I have seen, they are looking for what they like not judging how they were taught. To judge, judge to the rules and do it with an open mind. If you prefer BB and get spares, you don't mark down the spares you judge them based on how well they were done.

I had a judge tell me one time that if a piece of chicken didn't have a bone in it that it got marked down. This means anyone turning in breasts got marked down no matter how well they were done.

If a judge wants to go to all the teams and let them know what he likes and dislikes then fine but until then if it is a legal turn-in judge it on it's merits or get the fork off the table.

Sweet glaze, if your not turning it in then you are ignoring the fact that 90% of the public likes sweet, and turning ribs in dry with a dipping sauce gets you DQ'd.

SmokyOkie
02-23-2009, 10:52 PM
Interesting thread. I am a KCBS Rep, judge and judge trainer, I enjoy cookin much more than any of the rest.

Some of the worst judges are the Master Judges I have seen, they are looking for what they like not judging how they were taught. To judge, judge to the rules and do it with an open mind. If you prefer BB and get spares, you don't mark down the spares you judge them based on how well they were done.

I had a judge tell me one time that if a piece of chicken didn't have a bone in it that it got marked down. This means anyone turning in breasts got marked down no matter how well they were done.

If a judge wants to go to all the teams and let them know what he likes and dislikes then fine but until then if it is a legal turn-in judge it on it's merits or get the fork off the table.

Sweet glaze, if your not turning it in then you are ignoring the fact that 90% of the public likes sweet, and turning ribs in dry with a dipping sauce gets you DQ'd.

That's cuz it's KCBS instead of OKCBS.:roflmaoha0::D

In Oklahoma, BBQ is just done that way. I prefer most of it that way myself, but, while I don;t consider it to be BBQ, I love a plateful of chicken pieces glazed over with sweet smoky Ketchup. Gawd does that stuff bring back childhood memories!:eating:

Jake
02-24-2009, 01:43 AM
thats just it we all have memories of something mom...dad... etc cooked and did good then we go from there, i hate fish but i will still eat it or cook it cause the kids and pip like it, and i think i hate to do chicken cause my dad does it so good, :twocents: :shrug: bottom line is i still do it or am willing to even though im not 100% with it, and back to the point i will still taste it to see with out being bias about it. :shrug:

SmokinOkie
04-22-2009, 08:37 AM
Find out the "rules" of the contest, who's judging and how they are scoring.

There is a whole "circuit" of Rib Cook-offs, I call 'em Rib Rib offs. They're about vending to the public and making money off of rib sales.

Once you know the above specifics, you'll have a better chance of winning.

Smokin'